News & Podcasts

The Whole Marketer Podcast – Episode 151

Jul 28, 2025

Episode #151. Today’s focus is a technical skill on how to step change growth of your brand or business. When we refer to step change, we don’t mean incremental movements in growth, but a bold, substantial shift; whether that’s a significant reversal of brand decline or stepping out into new categories and territories in pursuit of brand-new growth opportunities. It requires a real mindset shift – plus bravery and curiosity – to step change growth of your brand of business. 

Joining Abby is her guest Jo McClintock, award-winning marketer and Trainline’s VP Brand and Marketing. Jo is known in the industry for her strategic thinking, combining brand purpose and commercial strategy for brands such as Moonpig, Skyscanner, Screwfix and today at Trainline. This has really shown up in big ideas such as the award-winning ‘I Came By Train’ sustainable train initiative to get more people out of cars and planes and onto the rails, as well as scaling Trainline into four new international markets. 

In this episode, Jo shares her definition of a step changing growth, how to bring new ideas to your team, building a collaborative culture that supports bold ideas, helping others to visualise to bring to life and making space for curiosity. 

Plus, her career highs and lows and advice for marketers of tomorrow. 

00:00:00 Welcome and Introduction to Step Change Growth

00:02:42 Defining Step Change Growth (00:02:42)  

00:04:15 Approach to Achieving Step Change  

00:05:36 Culture of Curiosity and Psychological Safety  

00:07:05 Critical Thinking and Accountability 

00:09:31 Building and Evolving Ideas Collaboratively  

00:12:33 Examples of Step Change at Trainline  

00:17:21 The “Four Worlds” framework (customer, culture, business, category) 

00:18:40 Permission to Think Big 

00:20:00 Jo’s Strategic Thinking Process 

00:25:03 Career Highs and Lows  

00:27:31 Advice for Marketers of Tomorrow  

Book Recommendation: Where ideas Come From Where Ideas Come From

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